Author Topic: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!  (Read 1975 times)

Ari Altman

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Comments or questions on TBG's Gamer's Bench article "Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters"? Post them here!

Secret

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2019, 05:35:07 PM »
A single radiator water-cooling the gpu and cpu would be ideal for this in a mini system.

Ari Altman

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2019, 08:33:09 PM »
A single radiator water-cooling the gpu and cpu would be ideal for this in a mini system.

I'm actually not sure that you can fit radiator hoses in for a GPU at all, and getting hoses in for two devices would be nearly impossible. I do have a 120mm CPU liquid cooler that I'd like to try in this case the next time I publish an article using it, and I'd specifically compare GPU temperatures in both configurations (with a CPU air cooler and an intake fan, and with a liquid cooler as an exhaust. Of course the CPU will run MUCH cooler, but I'm concerned about there being too little airflow in that scenario for a card like the RTX 2080 Ti.

I actually submitted a mockup of a compact case design to SilverStone that I think would allow more flexibility for modern high-end gaming systems. It's rough, but I figure you won't flame me for it! Here it is:



The concept is to extend the depth but reduce the height, allowing for dual radiators to be installed. Any truly high-performance system today really requires liquid cooling for the CPU, due to the heat output of Intel's latest offerings, but given how much power GPUs are using, opening up the option to do two rads is important. Phantkes did this with its Evolv Shift, but the problem with that case is that the side panels are glass, which raise temperatures dramatically despite an otherwise sound cooling design. It looks great, and it does allow dual radiators, but it essentially requires dual radiators because its air cooling is so bad.

Secret

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2019, 10:01:55 PM »
I agree that would be a much better design.  There is practically zero head room in that case now to pull air, I'm surprised you managed the temps you did.  That Phanteks case is a beaut, I was imagining a build in it the other week  ;D  I think they have a longer version as well.

Still if you ran a card with a water block that can be tapped from the back I think you'd have enough room for hoses to run a rad on the other side.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 10:06:40 PM by Secret »

Ari Altman

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2019, 05:58:45 AM »
Some good news out of SilverStone in response to this article - they are working on not one, but two "shoebox"-style cases as follow-ups to the SG13, and these are being designed to better accommodate modern high-powered components. TBG will be among the first to review them when they hit the market (hopefully later this year), so stay tuned!

Tarabomba from Yena Velt

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2019, 03:31:25 AM »
Hi Ari - Surprised you didn't suggest the larger albeit still very compact Fractal Design Core 500 case ( which I know you have used in the past) - the gain of 7-8 litres , similarly priced, with the potential to increase numbers/sizes of fans ( I have 2 x slim 120mm top intake fans) bigger coolant air space to push around as well as height for a larger CPU cooler (e.g Noctua D-15S), combined with a higher core CPU e.g. i7-8700k, possible ATX as well as SFF power supply & the ability to hold longer GPU cards - might your ability to drive all 4K games at compatible power levels and decent temps (could even delid the suggested CPU) all at potentially lower sound levels be better improved without massively increasing costs?
That kind of system might then give the optimal smaller factor build with air-cooling & still have the option of water cooling where deemed absolutely necessary e.g. i9-9900k - your thoughts ?

Ari Altman

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2019, 08:07:34 AM »
Hi Ari - Surprised you didn't suggest the larger albeit still very compact Fractal Design Core 500 case ( which I know you have used in the past) - the gain of 7-8 litres , similarly priced, with the potential to increase numbers/sizes of fans ( I have 2 x slim 120mm top intake fans) bigger coolant air space to push around as well as height for a larger CPU cooler (e.g Noctua D-15S), combined with a higher core CPU e.g. i7-8700k, possible ATX as well as SFF power supply & the ability to hold longer GPU cards - might your ability to drive all 4K games at compatible power levels and decent temps (could even delid the suggested CPU) all at potentially lower sound levels be better improved without massively increasing costs?
That kind of system might then give the optimal smaller factor build with air-cooling & still have the option of water cooling where deemed absolutely necessary e.g. i9-9900k - your thoughts ?

Hey, Tarabomba from Yena Velt, and welcome to the TBG Forum!

You know, I've actually given a lot of thought to how one might set up the Fractal Design Core 500 to be used with a 9900K and RTX 2080 Ti. I'm not sure if you're aware of the TGB PC Buyer's Guides, but the Core 500 is the featured case in the $2,000 Ultimate ITX Gaming PC, and the case has been featured in multiple articles on the site. Right after publishing the "Pusing ITX Gaming to the Limit" article, I added a new recommendation to the Core 500-based buyer's guide to flip the rear exhaust fan around and use it as an intake to help push air through the CPU's liquid cooler, and also exhaust GPU air being expelled upwards. I am also considering adding a 2080 Ti optional upgrade to that guide, as the 9900K is already the recommended processor, but for now, I have only added the 2080 Ti upgrade to the $2,500 Ultra-Extreme ITX Buyer's Guide, which uses the SilverStone Fortress case with a slim vertical orientation.

Here's the reason: I don't believe the layout of the Core 500 is ideal for GPU cooling. It would be better than the much smaller SilverStone SG13, but it's still not great. There's still a lot of areas in the case for hot air to get trapped. I believe the SilverStone Fortress is a better choice, and it still comes in at about 14 liters. That's much closer to the goal of getting a 9900K and RTX 2080 Ti into the smallest package.

In the end, what I think the industry needs is a new case design to accommodate these ultra-high-wattage CPUs and GPUs. One option is the Phanteks Evolv Shift, but while it has a good layout, Phanteks absolutely crippled it with glass panels that reduce airflow considerably. Luckily, SilverStone has told me that they are working on some new compact ITX cases that may provide an improved layout for the kind of cooling you need for the 9900K and RTX 2080 Ti when used in the ITX format, and hopefully that means dual liquid coolers!

Ari Altman

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Re: Pushing ITX Gaming to the Limit: The RTX 2080 Ti in Under 12 Liters!
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2019, 09:17:08 AM »
Hi Ari - Surprised you didn't suggest the larger albeit still very compact Fractal Design Core 500 case ( which I know you have used in the past) - the gain of 7-8 litres , similarly priced, with the potential to increase numbers/sizes of fans ( I have 2 x slim 120mm top intake fans) bigger coolant air space to push around as well as height for a larger CPU cooler (e.g Noctua D-15S), combined with a higher core CPU e.g. i7-8700k, possible ATX as well as SFF power supply & the ability to hold longer GPU cards - might your ability to drive all 4K games at compatible power levels and decent temps (could even delid the suggested CPU) all at potentially lower sound levels be better improved without massively increasing costs?
That kind of system might then give the optimal smaller factor build with air-cooling & still have the option of water cooling where deemed absolutely necessary e.g. i9-9900k - your thoughts ?

As a follow-up, I think you have an excellent setup for ideal CPU air cooling. But in my opinion, to use both a 9900K and an RTX 2080 Ti in a shoebox-style case, at least one of the devices has to be liquid-cooled. I think using the Core 500 with a CPU liquid cooler and a standard dual-slot RTX 2080 Ti (either two fans or three fans) would be better than the SilverStone SG13... but it's also 50% larger. Ultimately, I think a new design approach is required to optimize for these sorts of processors. If you look at the success of Corsair's One i160, which uses dual liquid coolers and just a single fan, you can see what's possible when a company thinks out of the box.  This of course is not going to be offered as a case at retail (Corsair confirmed that to me at CES 2019), in part because it's not something the average person could actually build in. With that said, if we pushed the volume up a bit to require fewer custom parts, I do think it could become the blueprint for a DIY solution.