Author Topic: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide  (Read 12252 times)

afiction

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #60 on: January 20, 2019, 01:30:22 AM »
I built this last week and I'm loving the performance and the look of it. I'm glad I went with the silver case. I love the subtle RGB color cycle peeking through on the mobo. Thank you for the guide. My temps do seem a bit high though at 38-45 idle with the NH12s so I'm thinking I need to position my fans better.

Welcome to the forum, afiction. Thanks for sharing your feedback on this build! That idle temp seems fine. The CPU is quite power hungry,  and idles pretty hot in any system. You went for the optional Noctua NH-L12S, correct? It can handle this CPU at reference clocks, but don't try to push a big overclock. Perhaps run a stress test using CPU-Z just to make sure it doesn't get over 90C.

Good to hear that my temps aren't unusual. Yes, I went with the Noctua NH-L12S. I just overclocked to 4.6 and it seems to stay under 82 during stress tests. I might squeeze in a fan between the heatsink and case (haven't measured how much room I have there) to keep it a tad cooler.

Your temps are very good, no worries. FYI, you have 13mm between the heatsink and side panel. Not enough to use any fan. The slimmest fans are 15mm thick.

EDIT: I take that back - you can get a 12mm thick fan, and there's only one to consider: the Scythe Slipstream. Mount that as an exhaust (not intake) on the side panel, and you'll be good to go!

I picked up the Scythe Slipstream and I'm running significantly cooler now. I really hope the market grows for these 120mx12mm fans, it would be nice to see some alternatives to the Scythe, but so far it's quiet and kicking butt. I'm loving this build. Thanks for the recommendations!

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #61 on: January 20, 2019, 09:37:04 AM »

Your temps are very good, no worries. FYI, you have 13mm between the heatsink and side panel. Not enough to use any fan. The slimmest fans are 15mm thick.

EDIT: I take that back - you can get a 12mm thick fan, and there's only one to consider: the Scythe Slipstream. Mount that as an exhaust (not intake) on the side panel, and you'll be good to go!

I picked up the Scythe Slipstream and I'm running significantly cooler now. I really hope the market grows for these 120mx12mm fans, it would be nice to see some alternatives to the Scythe, but so far it's quiet and kicking butt. I'm loving this build. Thanks for the recommendations!

That's great news, thanks for reporting back. Next month, the Buyer's Guide will be updated to recommend this configuration. I think enthusiasts will really appreciate it!

By the way, Scythe is a very reputable manufacturer, and at one point in the mid-2000s it made the best fans in the industry (I still have some running in a few machines). The Slipstream is a good fan, but it uses sleeve bearings, which aren't as smooth as fluid bearings. It's possible that there aren't fluid bearings available with the dimensions needed to fit in the 12mm profile, so it may continue to be the best option for the foreseeable future.

xrouge

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
    • View Profile
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 01:31:38 PM by xrouge »

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #63 on: March 06, 2019, 01:34:07 PM »
Acer Predator monitor - the link to the Canadian amazon.ca actually points to AOC monitor:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B06X9CBRTP/ref=as_li_qf_sp_asin_il_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=thtebusgu06-20&camp=15121&creative=330641&linkCode=as2&creativeASIN=B06X9CBRTP&linkId=d813df68f4e88e85d7bb3a74069c8824

Those two monitors are actually relatively interchangeable as they use the same panel, but I have fixed the links. Thanks for the heads up.

EnthusiastBuilder

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #64 on: March 30, 2019, 07:09:38 PM »
@Ari,

I recently faced a problem with a 2 year old machine based on Z270 chipset not being able to support Thunderbolt 3 (mini-ITX with video card in PCI slot so no add-on card). With Thunderbolt 3 becoming the standard for connectivity, I would like my next computer to support it (or this could cause me some grief in the future !)

The config you have provided is great, but I would be looking at replacing the motherboard with the ASRock Phantom (mini-ITX), which does have a thunderbolt 3 port (same physical format as USB Type C). From my readings, I believe the Phantom is the replacement for the Fatal1ty series.

Any information you could provide on whether this would be an issue with the current $2500 Ultra-extreme ITX build ?
(any key points to look at from a motherboard perspective to ensure this work with the rest of the equipment ?)

Many thanks for your advice.

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #65 on: March 30, 2019, 08:01:42 PM »
@Ari,

I recently faced a problem with a 2 year old machine based on Z270 chipset not being able to support Thunderbolt 3 (mini-ITX with video card in PCI slot so no add-on card). With Thunderbolt 3 becoming the standard for connectivity, I would like my next computer to support it (or this could cause me some grief in the future !)

The config you have provided is great, but I would be looking at replacing the motherboard with the ASRock Phantom (mini-ITX), which does have a thunderbolt 3 port (same physical format as USB Type C). From my readings, I believe the Phantom is the replacement for the Fatal1ty series.

Any information you could provide on whether this would be an issue with the current $2500 Ultra-extreme ITX build ?
(any key points to look at from a motherboard perspective to ensure this work with the rest of the equipment ?)

Many thanks for your advice.

Welcome to the Forum, EnthusiastBuilder! A few other forum members have inquired about the AsRock Phantom due to its Thunderbolt support, so it's definitely one I've considered for the guides. It is a bit more expensive than the competition, so for those who aren't as interested in Thunderbolt, it's a bit over-priced. My only concern about it when used in the $2,500 Ultra-Extreme ITX build is whether the Noctua CPU cooler will clear the heatsink array above the Phantom's I/O panel. This type of incompatibility is what got the Asus Impact board crossed off the list (one reader tried it and then informed me it didn't fit!). If you do decide to buy it, the very first thing I'd do is just hold the CPU cooler in position without the CPU in the board to see if it will hit the motherboard heatsink. That way you don't damage the motherboard while actually installing it and can still return it if necessary.

By the way, Thunderbolt 3 and USB Type-C are pretty close cousins, and I'm not sure you actually need Thunderbolt 3 in a system like this. One of its advantages is video output, but you'll be using a video card in this system, not the CPU's built-in graphics. Another advantage is video input via PCI Express, as with external GPUs. It can also deliver power, but you don't need that here. In my opinion, it's far more important on laptops than desktops. The only real advantage it has over USB 3.1 Gen 2 Type-C ports that come on all high-end ITX motherboards is a 40Gbps throughput, but you'd need devices able to support that, of which there are very few (that's  faster than any current SSD).

Put another way, Thunderbolt 3 is pretty cool, but not a must-have in a modern PC. Having Type-C is more important for future-proofing connectivity.

DrTroy

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Extreme Gaming Mini-ITX Build (SG13)
« Reply #66 on: April 01, 2019, 06:46:02 AM »
I got all mine built, up and running but had a right time trying to get BF5 running properly, I can only get 50-60 FPS at 4K.
Annoyingly MSI didn't throw any games in, others are offering BF5, Anthem, Metro...

I was wondering whether DX12, drivers etc where playing catchup to the latest hardware.
Anyone else had a similiar experience, games stuttering, slow down, on a 2080/i9?

thanks in advance
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 09:15:40 AM by DrTroy »

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: Re: The TBG Extreme Gaming Mini-ITX Build (SG13)
« Reply #67 on: April 01, 2019, 07:10:12 AM »
I got all mine built, up and running but had a right time trying to get BF5 running properly, I can only get 50-60 FPS at 4K.
Annoyingly MSI didn't throw any games in, others are offering BF5, Anthen, Metro...

I was wondering whether DX12, drivers etc where playing catchup to the latest hardware.
Anyone else had a similiar experience, games stuttering, slow down, on a 2080/i9?

thanks in advance

Glad to hear that you got the system up and running!

In terms of performance, 60fps at 4K on an RTX 2080 sounds about right. With that said, definitely use DX11 for the highest performance. DX12 offers image quality perks but is slower even at the same settings.

By the way, you running a 9900K and an RTX 2080 in the $2,500 FTZ01 build, right? I can move this post to that thread if you want.

DrTroy

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 10
    • View Profile
Re: Re: The TBG Extreme Gaming Mini-ITX Build (SG13)
« Reply #68 on: April 01, 2019, 09:16:39 AM »
Hi, yes sorry I am (FTZ)  ;D

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: Re: The TBG Extreme Gaming Mini-ITX Build (SG13)
« Reply #69 on: April 01, 2019, 11:26:05 AM »
Hi, yes sorry I am (FTZ)  ;D

Got it - moved it for ya!

bensrichards

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 35
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #70 on: May 06, 2019, 12:49:29 PM »
Anyone considered installing a Corsair H60 in the FTZ01?  I can't find the dimensions for the waterblock anywhere on Corsair's website, so I'm having trouble figuring out if the cooler would fit inside the 83mm height limit of the case with the included fan, or possibly with a slim fan.  Anyone with one of the new H60s able to put a ruler next to the waterblock?

I'm also a noob when it comes to any kind of liquid cooling, so if there's an obvious reason not to go barking up this tree, perhaps someone can enlighten me.  :)

In the meantime, I've just got my Scythe slim fan and am going to try the push pull setup mentioned earlier in this thread.  I get idle temps in the low 40s and load temps in the 70s or 80s with my stock Noctua NH-L12S and an 8600k right now.  Hoping to see some improvement with the extra fan.

-Ben

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #71 on: May 06, 2019, 01:04:00 PM »
Anyone considered installing a Corsair H60 in the FTZ01?  I can't find the dimensions for the waterblock anywhere on Corsair's website, so I'm having trouble figuring out if the cooler would fit inside the 83mm height limit of the case with the included fan, or possibly with a slim fan.  Anyone with one of the new H60s able to put a ruler next to the waterblock?

I'm also a noob when it comes to any kind of liquid cooling, so if there's an obvious reason not to go barking up this tree, perhaps someone can enlighten me.  :)

In the meantime, I've just got my Scythe slim fan and am going to try the push pull setup mentioned earlier in this thread.  I get idle temps in the low 40s and load temps in the 70s or 80s with my stock Noctua NH-L12S and an 8600k right now.  Hoping to see some improvement with the extra fan.

-Ben

Ben - this issue with the H60 isn't the height of the cooling block, it's the fact that you have to mount the huge radiator and fan combo somewhere. That's going to be the issue with the FTZ01.

But, since you asked so nicely, and I'm such a nice guy, I'll give you the dimensions of the H60. ;)  I don't have much excuse not to, since I happen to have it sitting about 2 feet away from me right now!

Here you go:

(1) Block: 32mm
(2) Radiator: 28mm
(3) Fan: 25mm

That adds up to 85mm, which is a no-go. Now, if you dropped the standard fan and used your Scythe fan, you may be able to squeeze it in, as you'd then be talking about a height of 72mm. Manipulating the cooler in my hands here, it does seem like you can just barely twist the hoses into position where you'd be able to "stack" the radiator/fan above the block, which is what you'd need to do in the FTZ01. But I can't guarantee that this isn't going to put a bit too much tension on those hoses.

If you decide to give it a try, please consider using this link to buy the H60 (2018), and definitely report back on whether it works. This could be huge for TBG readers if it's an option.

Jago

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #72 on: May 25, 2019, 06:35:51 PM »
Hi there,

I am new to building pc so I'm in need with advice, thank you for your help in advance. I have been looking on low profile coolers for i9, aside from the custom cooling solution you posted on the $2500 mini-ITX guide, will big shuriken 3 perform better? I have seen a video comparing low profile air coolers on the market but that is not the same setup as you suggested. Also, will any AIO fit into that 82mm space? Thanks for your help.

Jago

Ari Altman

  • TBG Founder
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3753
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #73 on: May 25, 2019, 08:24:54 PM »
Hi there,

I am new to building pc so I'm in need with advice, thank you for your help in advance. I have been looking on low profile coolers for i9, aside from the custom cooling solution you posted on the $2500 mini-ITX guide, will big shuriken 3 perform better? I have seen a video comparing low profile air coolers on the market but that is not the same setup as you suggested. Also, will any AIO fit into that 82mm space? Thanks for your help.

Jago

Welcome to the TBG Forum, Jago!

The Scythe Big Shuriken 3 is a new cooler designed to directly compete with the Noctua NH-L12S.  Its layout allows for more installation options, but it's not possible to set it up for dual-fan use, which limits its cooling capacity. I would stick with the solution set out in the guide, which will perform better.

As for liquid cooling, another forum member asked that recently too - have a look at the posts just above yours to see my response.

Jago

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The TBG Ultra-Extreme ITX PC Buyer's Guide
« Reply #74 on: May 26, 2019, 03:29:02 PM »
Sorry I missed that important comment. Since there is no feedback from the H60 comment, I might just go for the solution you provided in the guide. I have another question about this build (sorry I am just new to building pc, can't help to be so scared), will a blower style GPU (e.g. ASUS turbo) fits in better in this build? I assume that the CPU cooler is having a hard time cooling 9900k so base on this a blower style should help out with the stress for better thermals inside the case? Thanks for your help.