Author Topic: Upgrading CPU Questions  (Read 652 times)

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #45 on: July 14, 2017, 10:22:33 PM »
I game on both a 7700K and a 6900K. For some games, I prefer the lower power use of the 7700K, but for others, the 6900K is flat-out better, particularly Battlefield 1, where there's a massive performance difference. Yes, in some games the 7700K is faster, but it's never a huge difference, and remember, a 7820X overclocked to 4.2GHz, which should be quite attainable, is faster than a 6900K at maximum possible overclock.

I wouldn't recommend a 7700K to you now. I just don't think it's going to improve your experience greatly unless you really only play games on older game engines. And yes, you'd need a new Z270 (not Z170) board. Also, you may have 8 sticks of RAM - you could only use four with the Z270.

If it makes you feel any better, the 7820X is now completely sold out and available for backorder at $680, meaning it's already appreciated in value since you ordered it for under $600. In other words, it was a good investment. ;)

All kidding aside, if gaming really is your only concern, than the Core i7-7800X would be a good choice for you at $390. It's also backordered, but at least it hasn't gone up in price since it was released like the higher-end Skylake-X chips have. Plus, I know some of these have been shipping out, while the 7820X seems to be stuck in limbo. Your builder should be able to give it a nice overclock without too much trouble.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #46 on: July 15, 2017, 11:34:01 AM »
I'm just uneasy about everything now after doing more research.  Check out this article and all of these games.

https://www.techspot.com/review/1445-core-i7-7800x-vs-7700k/

It just seems that the 7700k is a perfect match for the 1080Ti.  It literally noticeably beats out the 7800 in almost every single game.  I may just stick with what I have and return the motherboard.  Or, get a 7700k and get a new set of ram since my ram wouldn't be compatible.  That's a lot cheaper for better performance plus I'd sell my current motherboard, processor, and ram, and come out about dead even.

It's either that, or stay with what I have because my main purpose is gaming and right now, the 7700k seems like the best processor overall under $600 for intel.  For single core and gaming.  At least that's my ending theory on it all.  I've never been one to care too much on the price vs performance chart but this is changing my mind.  I actually cancelled my 7800x at the moment until I'm sure exactly what I really want to do.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 02:48:31 PM by LongJon »

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #47 on: July 15, 2017, 03:53:06 PM »
I'm just uneasy about everything now after doing more research.  Check out this article and all of these games.

https://www.techspot.com/review/1445-core-i7-7800x-vs-7700k/

It just seems that the 7700k is a perfect match for the 1080Ti.  It literally noticeably beats out the 7800 in almost every single game.  I may just stick with what I have and return the motherboard.  Or, get a 7700k and get a new set of ram since my ram wouldn't be compatible.  That's a lot cheaper for better performance plus I'd sell my current motherboard, processor, and ram, and come out about dead even.

It's either that, or stay with what I have because my main purpose is gaming and right now, the 7700k seems like the best processor overall under $600 for intel.  For single core and gaming.  At least that's my ending theory on it all.  I've never been one to care too much on the price vs performance chart but this is changing my mind.  I actually cancelled my 7800x at the moment until I'm sure exactly what I really want to do.

I considered linking that for you earlier, but there are obvious problems with his setup, which he was defensive about in the comments. The long and short of it is that the Skylake-X platform needs to mature, and the motherboard firmware is clearly not quite ready. But Steve, having put lots of time into these benchmarks, decided to publish anyway, even though he would have to be aware that his Tomb Raider results, for example, just don't make sense, as they would be GPU-limited on properly functioning systems. For a hint at where I think the truth is, have a look at my older article testing the 4790K and 5820K. Published nearly two years ago, it came to some of the same conclusions as the TechSpot article, but without the obvious errors.

The reality is that a six-core, even one that uses the exact same architecture as a four core, will almost always trail the quad in games that can't use more than 4 threads. There's simply more overhead in managing more cores. But there are games that will take advantage of more cores, like Crysis 3 and Battlefield 1 multi-player, that TechSpot didn't bench.

The 7700K is no doubt a good gaming CPU, and is probably a better match today for a single GTX 1080 Ti (in fact, that's what's recommended in the TBG guides). If you decide to go that route, you should get it with the Asus Z270E Motherboard, which will offer a nice upgrade in features from what you have despite the lower price.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #48 on: July 15, 2017, 05:03:14 PM »
Thanks I gotcha.  Plus I think he did all his bench marking on 1080p and I play every game at 1440p if that even matters.  Anywho, does that motherboard have bluetooth?  I see it has WiFi.  Would I need to get different RAM?  I'm leaning toward going this route and upgrading again later on down the line (2019/2020) whenever it seems like 6/8/10 core processors and the matching motherboard architecture have matured a bit more and is being taken advantage of more by developers. 
« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 05:16:52 PM by LongJon »

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #49 on: July 15, 2017, 10:13:38 PM »
Yes, the motherboard has Bluetooth. And yes, you'd need different RAM if you wanted 32GB, but you can certainly use 16GB of what you have.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #50 on: July 15, 2017, 11:30:43 PM »
Yes, the motherboard has Bluetooth. And yes, you'd need different RAM if you wanted 32GB, but you can certainly use 16GB of what you have.

I ordered the 7700k and that motherboard you linked.  I'll more than likely get the RAM tomorrow (Sunday) but I need the 4x8 3200mhz instead of my 2x8 3000 right?
« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 11:43:40 PM by LongJon »

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #51 on: July 16, 2017, 08:04:59 AM »
Yes, the motherboard has Bluetooth. And yes, you'd need different RAM if you wanted 32GB, but you can certainly use 16GB of what you have.

I ordered the 7700k and that motherboard you linked.  I'll more than likely get the RAM tomorrow (Sunday) but I need the 4x8 3200mhz instead of my 2x8 3000 right?

You could go with 4x8GB DDR4-3200 kit, but I actually recommend a 2x16GB DDR4-3200 kit for use with the Z270 board. Running two sticks improves overall overclocking stability as it puts less stress on the memory controller.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #52 on: July 16, 2017, 11:07:20 AM »
Okay so I've purchased the 7700K, Z270 motherboard and RAM you linked.  My questions now are what I'm going give James when all of this stuff has arrived (should be by next Tuesday the 25th according to Amazon).
 
•   Delete all data on EXTERNAL hard drive, then back-up everything on PC to same external hard drive for a fresh new backup
•   Wipe all data from PC then do a fresh install of Windows 10
•   Install new x270 motherboard
•   Install new i7-7700K CPU
•   I’m going to sell the 5820k CPU, X99 motherboard, and my RAM on eBay so please set them aside….Very important!
•   Want RAM overclocked to 3000Mhz
•   Overclock CPU as well

Anything I should add to this?  Any numbers that need changing like the RAM to 3200Mhz?  What Ghz should he aim for on the 7700K?  4.2?  4.5?
Anything he needs to do to my 1080Ti overclocking/numbers wise when he's doing all of this?  Just want the best performance setup possible.  Also could you link the build of what I'm going with?  When I'm done my PC should have these components:

1. Processor - i7-7700K

2. Motherboard - ASUS ROG Strix 270E Gaming

3.)  New Video Card = EVGA GeForce GTX 1080Ti FTW3

4.). Corsair 2x16GB Vengeance LPX DDR4-3200 Black

5.)  Samsung 850 Evo 1TB 2.5 inch SATA III SSD

6.)  EVGA Supernova GS 1050W
Power Supply - $150

7.) Corsair HXi Series, HX1000i, 1000 Watt (1000W), Fully Modular Power Supply, 80+ Platinum Certified

8.)  New Disc Drive - Pioneer Bluray Burner

9.) Microsoft Windows 10

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #53 on: July 16, 2017, 11:40:31 AM »
You're basically going to have the $2,500 Extreme 4K Gaming Build when you're done. There are a number of minor  differences, but in terms of gaming, the performance will be the same. Note that you listed two different PSUs - I think you have the Corsair HX1000i, which is massively overpowered for this build, but that's OK. It could run two GTX 1080 Ti cards.

In a switch like the one you're making, you actually don't need to wipe the system drive and reinstall. You just need the new motherboard drivers installed to get it running. One issue that you'll have whether or not you format the drive is the need to re-activate your Windows 10 license. Hopefully James will know how to handle that, but you should definitely add to your list the need to activate Windows. I'll leave it up to you to decide whether you want to do a fresh install. It will certainly take more time, and if you're paying by the hour, I'd guess it could add at least another hour of work, probably more if you want him to re-install apps. You could also avoid the need for the whole backup this way.

So, here's the labor involved:
(1) Remove Core i7-5820K processor, Asus X99 motherboard, and 8 sticks of Corsair DDR4-3000 RAM and set aside for sale on Ebay
(2) Install new x270 motherboard
(3) Install new i7-7700K CPU
(4) Install two sticks of DDR4-3200 RAM

In terms of overclocking, here's what to say:
(1) Overclock RAM using 3200MHz XMP profile
(2) Overclock CPU to 4.8GHz
(3) Overclock GPU by 50MHz on the core and 400MHz on the memory

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #54 on: July 16, 2017, 12:03:44 PM »
Yeah I have the Corsair HX1000i, I meant to delete my old PSU off that list.  It'll be good to have the HX1000i for the future though I guess?  And good about not having to wipe and reinstall.  I just assumed when replacing the main components that it had to be done but that'll save some money.  Thanks for taking the time and writing all of that so now I'll copy and paste what you have and it should be easy for him.

Also, that game I play's latest patch solved all the issues as I figured/hoped it would.  And the last time he wiped my system like 9 months ago when it was having those power on problems, he reactivated my Windows 10 license then so I'm assuming he'll know how to do it again hopefully. 

Thanks again!

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #55 on: July 19, 2017, 11:52:58 AM »
A buddy of mine may be coming on here to get your opinion on where he should go with his gaming build he's putting together.  He's in my clan on that game I was telling you about.  I linked the site and referenced you.  Just think he should get your opinion before he makes any final decisions as you can point him in the right direction and get him the most for his money.  Not sure when/if he'll post but if so it'll be this week.


Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #56 on: July 19, 2017, 11:53:57 AM »
A buddy of mine may be coming on here to get your opinion on where he should go with his gaming build he's putting together.  He's in my clan on that game I was telling you about.  I linked the site and referenced you.  Just think he should get your opinion before he makes any final decisions as you can point him in the right direction and get him the most for his money.  Not sure when/if he'll post but if so it'll be this week.

I'll be on the lookout. Thanks for putting in the good word.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #57 on: July 20, 2017, 01:32:46 PM »
You're welcome.  I can't believe I'm asking but I'm sort of having buyers remorse.  Just tell me what you think, I'm looking at my 5820k right now on Amazon and seeing it for $374 and have a feeling all of this might not be worth it by going to the 7700k.  Maybe once overclocked it will?  Maybe I should just get a refund from Amazon?  I wouldn't mind going x299 and getting the 7820x but I want to let the boards and cards mature a little bit before I make that jump so I know all the issues have been ironed out.  And I want to see some tests in games where some 6, 8, 10, and up, really anything above a quad core starts to outperform 4 core cpu's in game consistently. 

In summary, at this moment, I'm leaning on either just keeping my setup as is and waiting a while for the next batch, or just going through with what I bought and using the overclocking numbers you gave me.  I just wonder if it is worth it.  Your final thoughts?

Ari Altman

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #58 on: July 20, 2017, 02:29:16 PM »
You're welcome.  I can't believe I'm asking but I'm sort of having buyers remorse.  Just tell me what you think, I'm looking at my 5820k right now on Amazon and seeing it for $374 and have a feeling all of this might not be worth it by going to the 7700k.  Maybe once overclocked it will?  Maybe I should just get a refund from Amazon?  I wouldn't mind going x299 and getting the 7820x but I want to let the boards and cards mature a little bit before I make that jump so I know all the issues have been ironed out.  And I want to see some tests in games where some 6, 8, 10, and up, really anything above a quad core starts to outperform 4 core cpu's in game consistently. 

In summary, at this moment, I'm leaning on either just keeping my setup as is and waiting a while for the next batch, or just going through with what I bought and using the overclocking numbers you gave me.  I just wonder if it is worth it.  Your final thoughts?

You could always wait for the "next big thing," but it won't necessarily be better for your purposes, i.e., gaming. It's very unlikely that the six-core Cannon Lake CPUs will actually out perform the 7700K. And as you've (and I've proven in multiple benchmarking articles), for pure gaming purposes with a single GPU, a Hyperthreaded quad-core is really the best all-around option, and the 7700K can overclock to 5GHz with ease.

LongJon

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Re: Upgrading CPU Questions
« Reply #59 on: July 21, 2017, 02:29:21 PM »
When talking about bitcoin and mining and stocks affecting computer building prices, what exactly are you guys talking about it that other thread?  What do you mean by miners and specific mining builds making graphics cards and other prices go up?  I was reading that thread and was quickly confused and sort of lost.  Is it all related to stocks?

I'm taking your advice btw and on Monday I'll drop off my PC and all my new components and go with the 7700k, new motherboard, and 3200 RAM.